MSNBC "In God We Trust" Poll

Should the motto "In God We Trust" be removed from U.S. currency? * 7889077 responses

Yes. It's a violation of the principle of separation of church and state.
20%

No. The motto has historical and patriotic significance and does nothing to establish a state religion.
80%
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Good...
 
Its a good job most of USA hold some sort of Christian moral fibre. If they ran a poll like that in the UK it would have about 140 votes and 95% would be Yes. :(
 
The sad thing about this is that the courts don't do what the people want. (Re: California Gay Marriage Ban Overturned)

In 2000, 61% of California voters approved a ballot measure, Proposition 22, that said "only marriage between a man and a woman is valid and recognized in California."
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While it's not a super majority (or whatever the proper term is) it's still the majority. The desires of the larger group were ignored because of political posturing by 4 judges.

Perhaps they think we should re-write the Declaration of Independence so it doesn't have any reference to God-given rights, while we're at it?

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bonds which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness
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We, therefore, the representatives of the United States of America, in General Congress, assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the name, and by the authority of the good people of these colonies, solemnly publish and declare, that these united colonies are, and of right ought to be free and independent states; that they are absolved from all allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the state of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as free and independent states, they have full power to levy war, conclude peace, contract alliances, establish commerce, and to do all other acts and things which independent states may of right do. And for the support of this declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.
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(Source)I find 4 references in just those two quotes. Clearly, this document needs to be destroyed. /sarcasm.
 
Plus, when you looking at 7934420 votes, two votes are not going to move the decimal place enough to show, unless they carried it out pretty far.

(Plus, MD requires belief in he existence of God to hold political office - Article 37, so it would seem hypocritical for it to be removed from money :) )
 
Genesis1315 said:
(Plus, MD requires belief in the existence of God to hold political office - Article 37, so it would seem hypocritical for it to be removed from money :)
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Wow, I didn't know that. Interest. Just goes to show how deeply rooted our country was is Christianity. To completely go about separating God from our money/governments would be to uproot the essence of this country.
 
Why do you guys sound so surprised?

Christianity is the largest religion in the world and the United States is roughly 80% Christian.

I would have been surprised if it was anything different.

EDIT to add this link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_God_We_Trust

Looks like the motto wasn't added to coins until 1864, due to increased religiousity during the Civil War.

Prior to that, I can't find evidence of God on our currency. http://frbsf.org/currency/

Kinda hard to read some of those notes, but if anyone can point me to something better, I'd appreciate it.

It's also important to remember that the Christian persecution that drove the Puritans here was BY CHRISTIANS. http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/religion/religion.html
 
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Dark Virtue said:
Christianity is the largest religion in the world and the United States is roughly 80% Christian.
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But how many people are actually Christians? How many people actually go to church every Sunday. Actually pray and have a relationship with God? How many actually read the Bible? Everyone in the world can say they are a Christian. Its just a label, being a Christian is different than having a relationship with Jesus. Which is being a true Christian.
 
Gods_Peon said:
Alot of people label themselves christian, which is most likely a mislabelling of themselves.
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Of course they are. If I was to say I wasn't a Christian my parents would about disown me, and I bet it is the same for a startling number of families. There is little room for religious tolerance in the conservative areas of the US, which is very sad as families are ruined over what should be a personal matter.

Also you can factor in the people who say "Yes" thinking it will avoid getting them into a conversation about going to church or worst, being preached to in public.
 
Gods_Peon said:
Alot of people label themselves christian, which is most likely a mislabelling of themselves.
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I suspect a great number of those are because they don't truly undersatnd what being a Christian means. Believing in the existance of God, or believing the possibility that there really was an "Adam and Eve," "Noah's Ark," or whatever other kids story... doesn't make you a Christian. That's a huge sticking point that I had to deal with a few years ago.

Stc95 said:
But how many people are actually Christians? How many people actually go to church every Sunday. Actually pray and have a relationship with God? How many actually read the Bible? Everyone in the world can say they are a Christian. Its just a label, being a Christian is different than having a relationship with Jesus. Which is being a true Christian.
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Quoted for truth. Sitting in the garage doesn't make me a car. Sitting in church (and daydreaming, thinking about football, people-watching) doesn't make you a Christian.

VK said:
If I was to say I wasn't a Christian my parents would about disown me
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As for the family issue? I don't talk to a majority of my family for differences in our beliefs of morality, attitude, and how we live our lives. They see me as a self-righteous, arrogant, pompous brat. I see them as hateful, spiteful, arrogant, self-serving bigots. If they decide they're done lying, cheating, stealing, and treating everyone else like they're inferiors... then I'd be happy to talk to them. But I have no desire to associate with them if they continue to act how they do now. I love my family, but I hate what they do. And that separation came long before I started going to church. So to be completely honest, I think copping-out based on religion is hooey.

VK said:
people who say "Yes" thinking it will avoid getting them into a conversation about going to church or worst, being preached to in public.
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You shouldn't lie (tell a half-truth, stretch the fine-line of what you really do-and-don't believe) if someone asks you what you believe in, then complain about the fact that people want to talk about what you just claimed to believe. If you're too weak to stand up and declare what you believe, then you deserve to be talked into a hole.

If you don't have a relationship with Jesus, don't believe He really walked the Earth, don't believe that He is the Messiah... then don't tell me that you do. If you have no desire to have faith, I don't understand, but can deal with that. I have several co-workers that are atheists, agnostics, or otherwise undecided. I respect their decision and move on. Sure, I don't talk to them the same way that I do my Christian co-workers, but that's because I don't inundate them with discussions about faith.

There are several here that got into the CGA because of the clans or groups they were in that were primarily geared to a Christian audience. DarkVirtue has been kind enough to humor each of us that explore his past, want to talk religious talk with him, and yet he stands up time and time again for what he chooses to believe and comes out all the more respected for it (not that what we think of him matters, anyway).

If you're not a Christian, then don't claim to be.
If you're not a vegetarian, then don't claim to be.
If you're not a rocket scientist, then don't claim to be.
If you're not a man, than don't claim to be.
If you're not bald, dying or cancer, moving to Kansas, playing the latest video game, going to the movies this Friday... then don't claim to be.

It's so much easier if you just tell the truth like it is, and let everyone else deal with their hurt feelings.

I stood up at an administrative meeting last week and admitted to my operations chief (on tape, mind you) that I break about 7 company policies every single day I work because the policies don't work, need changed, need removed. There are bound to be consequences of that, but if I'm not willing to push for the changes that need made, then I should just stop complaining about the issues and do what all the other lemmings do.... sit there and take it because it's easier.

My dad makes fun of me for getting involved at the church. It didn't stop me from teaching Sunday School last week, or telling him that I was doing it. Afraid of what your parents think? Unless you're young enough that you're stuck in their house.... grow up.

I know I'm coming across harsh, and expect to get reported... but seriously, don't claim to be something you're not then cry about the repercussions.
 
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Stc95 said:
But how many people are actually Christians? How many people actually go to church every Sunday. Actually pray and have a relationship with God? How many actually read the Bible? Everyone in the world can say they are a Christian. Its just a label, being a Christian is different than having a relationship with Jesus. Which is being a true Christian.
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The problem is that no one can define what a "True" Christian is. That's a logical fallacy referred to as the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.

Christianity has a LONG history of pointing fingers (and swords) at other Christians that aren't part of their group, from its inception until today.

Durruck said:
DarkVirtue has been kind enough to humor each of us that explore his past, want to talk religious talk with him, and yet he stands up time and time again for what he chooses to believe and comes out all the more respected for it (not that what we think of him matters, anyway).
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Thanks :)
 
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Dark Virtue said:
The problem is that no one can define what a "True" Christian is. That's a logical fallacy referred to as the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.

Christianity has a LONG history of pointing fingers (and swords) at other Christians that aren't part of their group, from its inception until today.
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Only the person them self can know if they are a Christian or not, which, as you have said already, no one really knows if anyone else is one or not, we just think that, "That person goes to church, so they must be a Christian, right?"
 
Yes I do, and not because I'm a Christian, but because its our Nation's history and its not hurting anyone. Don't fix what ain't broke.
 
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