Rant

Thaddius

Thaddius

Member
<rant>
Why is it those that complain all the time(see any thread in these two forums asking for *this or that* and you'll see mostly the same names) are the ones unwilling to put forth funds or comittments to ToJ? They join other clans, create there own clans, want it "this way" instead of "that way" because they like it better "this way". Yet when it comes down to it, these people only hang around to play on our server and complain about how "this could be done better" instead of trying to become an asset to ToJ.

Do you guys even realize how much time and money that Elite (before) and Plankeye(now) and HCS (custom) have put into maintaining a game server? I can show you numbers of what it costs and what we do get in donations does not even come close to that amount. Not only that, but each of them has a family that comes first. So while some of you are sitting here everyday complaining, think about what other people are sacrificing to make sure you have a place to play CS.

The lack of appreciation from some of you is disturbing.... :(
</rant>

Cory
 
Why is it those that complain all the time(see any thread in these two forums asking for *this or that* and you'll see mostly the same names)are the ones unwilling to put forth funds or comittments to ToJ?
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- Maturity

Yet when it comes down to it, these people only hang around to play on our server and complain about how "this could be done better" instead of trying to become an asset to ToJ.
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- Lack of Volunteering

Do you guys even realize how much time and money that Elite (before) and Plankeye(now) and HCS (custom) have put into maintaining a game server?
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- Lack of Funds
- Forgetting
- Willing, but problems

Not only that, but each of them has a family that comes first.
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- Lack of Responsibility

So while some of you are sitting here everyday complaining, think about what other people are sacrificing to make sure you have a place to play CS.
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- Lack of Responsibility and Maturity



All points for people that don't help out, including me(to not make everyone feel bad).
 
Well, only PayPal... I don't got no credit card. =O

I would maybe I dunno... 30$ every 2 months? *ie: that's half my allownace*
 
It's not just money that is important. If your a kid and don't have the means to donate money, thats perfectly ok. There are other ways that you can help ToJ. The main issue with my rant is you have a handful of people who do most of the stuff within ToJ and those are the ones always being fed demands. HCS created a custom server for everyone who wanted custom maps. Plankeye has changed maps on several occasions on the main server because of complaints. Not everyone is going to be happy with how the server is setup, you can't please everyone. The last complaint was because it was always on the same few maps. The new complaint is when it goes to any map but those, everyone leaves. You see the problem with always having to change things to appease the masses? The opinion of the masses always changes. Once you start getting into custom maps, people that don't want to download them will leave. And thats just on maps....Complaints about hackers and people being vulgar, a means was made for people to be reported and a mail address to send demos. We joined Steambans. You want AMX mod but it lags the server, so if we do that, people will complain about the server lag.

Just be happy you have something and people are willing to work to bring it to you. This isnt a perfect world and we all can't have everything our way.

The money comment was mainly that if you end up pushing these guys over the edge, there will no longer be a CS/NS/UT server if they quit ToJ.

Cory
 
Well since I can't give any moneyt then I'll donate my time. If anyone needs help on anything and I know how to fix it just ask and I'll help as much as I can!


Besides didn't mean to start any problems with the AMX mod post. Didn't know it was a big deal.

Sorry,
Ryan :)
 
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I've tried volunteering multiple times, only to be ignored, so I think I'm excused when I make suggestions and complaints.
 
i would send money to u guys every chance i could get but i barely have enough to pay for a bus to youth group.... but i love u guys and ur efforts and regarding the clan thing..... we just wanted to scrim, but for me Toj comes first. if u need anything im there.
 
Guys it isn't only money that is the problem here...I think thad is also stating that we should give the people who maintain the servers time to decide map lists and things and not push them onto them...It seems every time we get a new map cycle change someone wants something else...
 
It seems every time we get a new map cycle change someone wants something else...
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You should make it a rule:

Rule #21: DO NOT HARASS THE ADMINS FROM HAVING A NEW MAP CYCLE!

:)

I've tried volunteering multiple times, only to be ignored, so I think I'm excused when I make suggestions and complaints.
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Mainly cause people dont read all the people's posts on a topic. (Depending on their "willing to read and understand everyone") Like mine, which only admins will look at cause they know this post can be threating.

*Admins lock Corpfox in Jail*

:D
 
MaxX said:
I've tried volunteering multiple times, only to be ignored, so I think I'm excused when I make suggestions and complaints.
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Maxx,

Shoot me an email on what kind of help your willing to give. I have never seen your name come up before as someone who submitted interest in helping out. I can post it in the staff forums and see if we have a hole we can plug you with.


Cory
 
Thaddius said:
<rant>
Why is it those that complain all the time(see any thread in these two forums asking for *this or that* and you'll see mostly the same names) are the ones unwilling to put forth funds or comittments to ToJ? They join other clans, create there own clans, want it "this way" instead of "that way" because they like it better "this way". Yet when it comes down to it, these people only hang around to play on our server and complain about how "this could be done better" instead of trying to become an asset to ToJ.

Do you guys even realize how much time and money that Elite (before) and Plankeye(now) and HCS (custom) have put into maintaining a game server? I can show you numbers of what it costs and what we do get in donations does not even come close to that amount. Not only that, but each of them has a family that comes first. So while some of you are sitting here everyday complaining, think about what other people are sacrificing to make sure you have a place to play CS.

The lack of appreciation from some of you is disturbing.... :(
</rant>
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Sorry, all. I have to side with Thad on this one. I understand that people who complain may have good intentions in mind when they post their concerns, but there's many more complaints than statements of appreciation in this community. It's hard for those who put their time, effort, and money into this community not to resent those who invest little to nothing in the server and imply they have a "right" to demand changes.

If you haven't been selected as a server admin and if you can't donate funds toward server hosting costs, then you can still contribute something very valuable to ToJ: statements of appreciation. I know that the human tendency is to speak up only when something goes wrong; I struggle with that tendency, too.

I'm not saying that members who can't donate funds shouldn't voice their concerns regarding the server. I am saying that all criticism should be constructive criticism. For every server problem you cite, you should also post something you like about the server. It's a simple matter of tact.

So don't stop making suggestions for the server. Just show some love when you do. There's a lot of people pouring time and money into this community that they could be spending elsewhere.
 
^_^

MaxX said:
I've tried volunteering multiple times, only to be ignored, so I think I'm excused when I make suggestions and complaints.
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I have to agree here, i once tried to help and volunteer, or at least wanted to..but i wasnt sure who to talk to..maybe if there was a part of the faq that you guys are working on...that answer questions about the cost and hard work that people put into toj, and how they can help out..you may get some more people helping :) just a suggestion
 
As a family member, it is very hard to have someone dedicate as much time as HCS did. The server moves took quite a bit of time from the family. I knew it was coming and was able to plan it out, but it did affect time we could spend together. It saddens me to hear people complain or even whine about "well I tried to help but nothing panned out so I don't want to hear anything about it."

I truely hope that when an issue surfaces, that it will be appropriately addresses. Many times, it is not what is said, but how it is said.

I also am aware that financial issues are tricky, but I really think this needs to be addressed. Before we travel down the road of allowances etc, please remember that there are also mortgages, rent, car payments, raising children etc. We all have financial commitments. It may be only $10 here or there, but that amount adds up. While it would be nice if the Kingdom of God could be advanced without having to purchase anything, we do live in the world where money is a driving force. Perhaps some creative thinking could help raise funds for ToJ. For those who do not work, maybe coordinating something with a parent to earn some money that is ear-marked for ToJ.

Tek has worked hard to develop this gaming community into what we have here today. He has been blessed with many people to shared his vision and have dedicated time, money, etc to helping ToJ grow. I hope this will open some doors to further enable the growth and positive development.
 
Seems like its pointed towards me (im not saying that it IS or anything, but since im the one that goes in the category i'll say something)

Why is it those that complain all the time(see any thread in these two forums asking for *this or that* and you'll see mostly the same names) are the ones unwilling to put forth funds or comittments to ToJ?
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You haven't seen the email that i sent to some of the staffs, that Team zD volunteering to help out ToJ competition team to practice and give stratagies. The other day Myself, PoisoN, Alex(from Team zD) participated in a scrim with Parakletos and B-man.

They join other clans, create there own clans, want it "this way" instead of "that way" because they like it better "this way".
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ToJ I believe allows mult-clan'ing as i understand its a Christian Community. I maybe part of another competitive team, but that doesn't stop me from being active in ToJ does it? :D

Do you guys even realize how much time and money that Elite (before) and Plankeye(now) and HCS (custom) have put into maintaining a game server? I can show you numbers of what it costs and what we do get in donations does not even come close to that amount.
Click to expand...
I think for all the time while i was in ToJ (even while i was inactive) I knew it was them who was running the server and I put in some good infos about server rates, client rates to help steady the server usage. That should be considered helping :|

The lack of appreciation from some of you is disturbing....
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I respect the server admins, and those who maintain the server, and personally I think this is based towards the Map-thread me and choppy made. On that, we were stating what the community thought, and not once we wanted to show disrespect, we were asking for change. Couple of the maps remove great amount of people and it ruins game play because of people just camping in spawns just becuase they don't know the map well. Again, I respect their work and appreciate it greatly for allowing us to use the server.

Guys it isn't only money that is the problem here...I think thad is also stating that we should give the people who maintain the servers time to decide map lists and things and not push them onto them...It seems every time we get a new map cycle change someone wants something else...
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We even put a voting thread (check the server discussion) on this, and we have definite reason for each map change. If u request it, i'll post it here, or email it to all the admins, or your self also.

Thats couple things i wanted to say on behalf of me.
 
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[7F]Pilgrim said:
I have to agree here, i once tried to help and volunteer, or at least wanted to..but i wasnt sure who to talk to
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With Rizz on "sabbatical," I'm currently handling all new staff appointments. Things are going a bit slowly as I appoint members to various positions, but beefing up our staff is my top priority in ToJ at the moment.

Also keep in mind that appointing staff is not a simple process of telling people to line up, pick out something they like, and get to it. Almost all staff members must be trained; when you're short on staff, those staff members feel the squeeze of having to perform their regular duties AND train up new staff members.

Expanding ToJ's staff is a daunting task. I have to walk away from the PC once in a while and clear my head to make sure I don't get overwhelmed by all the work that has to be done to move ToJ into its next phase.

So please have patience while I turn my attention to building up our staff.
 
Flashon said:
Seems like its pointed towards me (im not saying that it IS or anything, but since im the one that goes in the category i'll say something)
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While I haven't chatted with Thad since he started this thread, I have sincere doubts that his initial post was directed solely at one or two or even three people. The attitude he addressed has been seen time and time again in this community.
You haven't seen the email that i sent to some of the staffs, that Team zD volunteering to help out ToJ competition team to practice and give stratagies. The other day Myself, PoisoN, Alex(from Team zD) participated in a scrim with Parakletos and B-man.
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And that is appreciated. My memory is a bit fuzzy, so I don't remember if Thad posted before or after you sent your e-mail regarding Team zD to ToJ leadership.
ToJ I believe allows mult-clan'ing as i understand its a Christian Community. I maybe part of another competitive team, but that doesn't stop me from being active in ToJ does it?
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No, but it does bar you from joining any ToJ CS competition teams. Anyone playing for a ToJ CS competition team can not be a member of another clan or play for another team.

Thad and I have both watched people leave ToJ to form their own teams instead of staying to help form a ToJ competition team on several occasions. No matter the reasons people leave to form their own teams, these situations can be very frustrating to ToJ CS leaders trying to develop ToJ competition teams.
On that, we were stating what the community thought, and not once we wanted to show disrespect, we were asking for change.
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Aye, I know that, but all members have to consider how their posts will be read by leaders--just as leaders have to consider how their posts will be read by members. There have been plenty of situations where people on both sides had good intentions but just failed to see eye-to-eye.

FlashoN: I do appreciate that you showed respect and kept a level head when posting. Discretion and prudence go a long way to establishing good relations between leaders and members of any group.

I think Thad wanted the community at large to know the frustration we're experiencing so everyone knows what we (leaders) want from the members. We want to see eye-to-eye with members; sometimes that requires sharing our frustrations.

It's not a fun part of communication, but it's necessary--and far better than ignoring the situation until it explodes. Heh. Trust me. I know. ^^;;
 
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Yeah guys...don't want to much pressure on Tek7 on the stuff for he still has school...don't want to make him fail...
 
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