Asatru 101: Basic Tenets and Beliefs

The Norns, who know all fates, say that Good WILL triumph over evil in the final battle, but only at the cost of sacrificing most of what is Good. As the Norn are outside of time - ARE time in many ways - I trust their vision. They see farther even than the Allfather - but they are too occupied with weaving the web of fate to intervene.

Why fight? What alternative is there?

Eon
 
Do we sit on our tush and watch as the world gets shot to hell, though? I wonder.
And why won't Odin get some equipment upgrades? I mean, geez, going in swinging the bronze and charing with helmut is just a tad outdated. Get some napalm up to Ragnarok, nuke the minions straight to hell, snipe em from a distance with .50 caliber rifles and blast em through with assault guns. Why freaking swords and steelheads?!

And why do you limit Christians to not being able to change the world? Is that your perception? It's 100% false; we have aided in changing the world for worse since our origins, but we have had a few pillars of light who have helped to better this pathetic corpse of Ymir.

And, umm, how often does Isis step out and talk in public to naturist Wiccans?
 
Well, this is supposed to be a fight between WARRIORS not between SOLDIERS. Needn't be bronze, of course, the Vikings were good with Iron and even with steel later on. The whole point is that this is supposed to be a test of skill, courage, bravery and ferocity - not a technological arms race. As for Napalming Surt, the dude rules the realm of FIRE...

Besides which I'd take Mjolnir over a .50 Barret any day - and even Napalm can't crush mountains! ;)

And as for the rest of it, I think you miss my point. What does Yahweh need you for, anyway - what do you bring to the equation? What's your role in the kingdom of heaven?

Eon
 
Umm...really, no purpose at all. Why do your gods need you, if I may? If your Gods are motivated by love, then what then is my God motivated by? Childish spoils? I doubt it. I think the reason He wants me in heaven is because, for some reason or another, He wants to give me something beautiful to have, something that we ruined before, but something this time we can't ruin because we've made our final choice. A choice destroyed Earth once. A choice will let me see it renewed.
I guess you missed the sarcasm there in the previous post. My bad.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]What does Yahweh need you for, anyway -
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YHVH doesent need us. Rather he wants us. He wants to have a relationship with us and save us from hell.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]what do you bring to the equation?
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Our purpose on earth if that is what you are asking is to preach the gospel and do what we can to save people.  
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]What's your role in the kingdom of heaven?
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To have a relationship with God and enjoy our reward for being good servants.
 
But, and here is my point, how are you good servants if you fulfil no vital role. Surely God can't have just created you guys to fail to save the other guys that he created? What would be the point in that?

Sorry Avatar - answered your post fairly late at night after a skinfull and I *DID* miss the sarcasm. My apologies and a large red face for being a humourless git.
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On the subject of your rebuttal, though, Yahweh preferred us when we were one person, naked, stupid and little more than an animal - why return to that state (even if you DO get to be the one person!)?

Eon
 
im gonna do a big post a little later, but for now about being naked n stupid, but if we didt eat the fruit we would have a joy that is lost. a special joy that can only be found that 1 way. so humanity has lost a special joy and if ur gonna say what bout bein in heaven joy. technically we would go to heaven anyways since we didt have sin.
 
There's a term for that kind of joy, Atown - it's called Childlike. Eventually everyone has to grow up...

Eon
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]But, and here is my point, how are you good servants if you fulfil no vital role. Surely God can't have just created you guys to fail to save the other guys that he created? What would be the point in that?
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Well there are christians who believe we play no role and god picks out who goes to heaven and hell. However I am not one of those christians. Our role is very vital. Or atleast I consider saving people from a eternal flame vital. He created us to be perfect and to be like him. However out of our own freewill we sinned. He dident create us to fail but we did. So now our new purpose is to save others.
 
I have a feeling he did create us to fail. PRedestination. He made the world to fail, so he could remake it. Why though, I don't know.
I dislike thinking too much about the unfathomability of God. He is simply believable, but at the same time, so unbelievable.
I need help. And I can't get it. The Bible doesn't fulfill it, so don't tell me to look to it for reassurance, because what good is it to verify God by something God says is unquestionable? It's logical fallacy.
But the only way I can answer some questions that arise on my own about God is to see what others, the Bible, says about Him. And those questions are answered and when I think on them, I can see how true they are.

But there are some, for instance, yours Eon's, about our point if God's almighty and really doesn't need us, that can't be answered. And they serve one of two: chip away at faith or strengthen it.

However, Eon, you have yet to answer: what purpose do yours Gods desire of you? A place in history? A place in the end? What, then? That's what we'll get, too. A place in the end, a place alongside our God forever. And we'll be happy. And I think that will bring joy to God as well, that we are happy.

And that begins to answer why Eden failed. God made us to choose, not so were born happy to be children forever, to be slaves to some kind of forsaken "love", as a Twilight Zone episode told me (love potion episode of one lusting man for another woman's non-love). So we chose. And we chose to say, "Forget God!" and went our route. And we've learned that we cannot stand on our own in the end, when it really matters. Through life, yes, but at death, no. And so God is another option still, after our initial breakaway choice. And to choose God to live in happiness eternally is not to become some dumb animal (we were not, to begin with), but to realize the fruits of our ultimate choice: life, and to see the implications still at the end of what death meant. And it won't be all ho-hum, eating of ambrosia and skinny-dipping in the River of Life or playing hide-and-seek in the Tree of Life, or sitting on God's lap like some f'ing Santa Clause.
It will be work, still. There will be a new Earth, and maintenance for it. Who knows what happens at the endtimes? I don't, so I won't presuppose. But from what the Bible does say: there won't be merely screwing off in heavenly peace. There's something to the end.
 
ok 1 more thing bout God chosing peopel to heaven n hell: GOD KNOWS ALL, BUT HE DOESNT CONTROL WHO GO TO HEAVEN OR NOT BECUASE OF STUPID FREE WILL! hmm good points eon but im gonna come at this from a difrent angle. and this angle is from somethin i posted in the topic "what is god" or somethin like that. astrologists are now days finding that the universe is so finely tuned to be able to have life that the chance of our universe auctually happing in a big bang is 2786 to the power of 10. and most astrologists are agreeing that there has to be a being removed from space and time with a will of his own. now what ur saying is these "gods and goddess'" can live and die therefor they are bound to space and time. if being restrained by space and time isnt a weakness i dont know what is.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I have a feeling he did create us to fail. PRedestination. He made the world to fail, so he could remake it.
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Oh ok he is sending people to hell and creating chaos and pain just so he can rebuild the world. I wonder where all that God is abounding in love stuff went. After all if he made us to fail sin and everything sinfull would be his fault.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Ultima Avatar @ Jan. 01 2004,6:04)]I dislike thinking too much about the unfathomability of God. He is simply believable, but at the same time, so unbelievable.
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Good point.

I'm picturing in my head all the contradictions we (Christians) get ourselves into when trying to explain God.

So, God sits down one day and decides to create the Earth and Man. Instantly, not even instantly though, more like pre-instantly, He realizes that Man will choose himself over God, and be separated from Him. Yet He does it anyway. Hmm...

Then you must think - well, He is God, after all. If he's omnipotent, omiscient, and omnipresent, does that lead to an ultimate omnicausality? Is God extratemporal, even though he intercedes into temporal human lives? [Clark Pinnock has some interesting things to say about this, most notably in his book The Unmoved Mover, I believe.]

Now I have a headache.

The big thing that separates us from our God is the word "why?". We don't know, we're too stupid; and that's where faith comes in. He's made some promises though that I've seen fulfilled. I can look into history and reasonably deduce that my faith is viable, though it's been trampled upon and mangled by establishment.

I'm forced to believe that the times I've unexplicably felt comforted, or the times I've been healed have been caused by the One and Only God. I believe He can do everything that a pantheon of gods can do and more. Not to be overly cynical, but after being healed I've certainly not had Odin tap me on the shoulder and say, "Oh, by the way Charles, it wasn't 'God' who healed you, it was me", although I've never had God tap me on the shoulder and tell me something explicitly either.

I dunno...I'm not doing a very good job as an apologist here...
 
Atown, actually scientists are saying that they believe that evidence of at least microbial life at some point in Mars' prehistory will be found sooner or later. They are also quietly confident of life on Europa too, and the belief is that if Life can come into existence on three bodies in just one system, then the odds of life NOT existing in some other system are negligible.

Really - just go study Drake's equation.

N=R*fs*fp*ne*fl*fi*fc*L

Where N is the number of communicating lifeforms within our galaxy right now. I use this more as a way of showing how damn big the galaxy is than as a serious method of calculation - because we have little empirical data for the last half of the equation!

Eon
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Eon @ Dec. 31 2003,5:59)]And as for the rest of it, I think you miss my point. What does Yahweh need you for, anyway - what do you bring to the equation? What's your role in the kingdom of heaven?

Eon
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Forgive my cynicism here.  
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Jehovah needs people to worship him.  That is what Christians bring to the equation.  An eternity of praising Jehovah (according to my Baptist education).  There is going to be a couple of big wars ("Armegeddon" and "Jesus versus Satan"), but...IIRC, Jesus' return ends Armegeddon, and that Christians are pretty much going to be sitting on the sidelines watching Jesus and the Angels put a beatdown on Satan and his Demons.

Heh.

It also kind of begs the question of why anyone would try to take on an omnipotent being.  Also, why would Jehovah even need to "fight" Satan in the conventional sense...one word, Satan's beaten...right?

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Avatar, if you don't mind my asking this...your post kind of sounded like you expect to be Jehovah's serf on the New Earth.  Is that about right?

If so...interesting take on it. (no sarcasm or insult intended...on that.)
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Atown @ Jan. 01 2004,11:08)]astrologists are now days finding that the universe is so finely tuned to be able to have life that the chance of our universe auctually happing in a big bang is 2786 to the power of 10. and most astrologists are agreeing that there has to be a being removed from space and time with a will of his own.
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Ahem.

I trust you mean astronomers, since astrologers are the people who do horoscopes.
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Also, whether one believes that there are no gods and it is 100% evolution or that there was no evolution and goddidit all...it strikes me as the height of pride that we would have the only life in the universe.

Kind of like believeing that we were literally the center of the universe and everything revolved around us.
 
But Eon, you didn't say astrologers...Atown did.
Serfs for eternity...maybe. I guess the word for it would be "stewards". We would be serving God for the rest of non-time (which toggles the bims of my zitflangs) on a paradise Earth, re-creating what used to really suck. I don't think our knowledge and mentality would be wiped away and replaced with a clean sheet of divine aphrodisiac.

Well, see Eon. The rock from Mars in the Antarctic region really isn't viable evidence for even a remote guess at life on Mars. And the idea that if there's water on Europa, there could be life is applaudable, but we haven't gotten there just yet. 2010 and 2061 are satisfiable books for fiction, but not satisfiable enough.

Yes, popdrinker. He is. He can. Why not? What have we done to deserve to live forever after years and years and years and years of growing up knowing about God and then looking on the other side of the fence at pimps, murder, lovely rape, curving whores, alluring fields of drugs, deception's visage of beauty and idolatry upon this dark world? What have we done? Nothing. So if God decides to start picking us off like flies, more almighty power to Him.
I just don't think that's how He'll do it. We have a choice now, long after the world's creation and ultimate damnation. God won't make it for us, but God knows what we'll do, and God made the world knowing this, so perhaps God is to blame at some point, so maybe God is the cause of the world's suffering as well as the world's joy. Symbiosis of love, perhaps. Why not?
 
heheh mistype on my part. and eon u said scientist. scientist and astronomers have 2 completely difrent fields of expertise. try going to www.reasons.org they have radio programs and kool stuff like that. and u can do ur own research and it will agree with these guys. and one of the guys Hugh Ross came to my church and did a mini seminar and so thats where im gettin alot of my info
 
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