Help! I'm drowning in a pool of my own drool!

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Killerah

New Member
http://www.ataricommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=459557
WOW WOW WOW WOW. Lots of yummy info about the next UT game codenamed "Envy". Check out some of these screens! http://img218.exs.cx/img218/2628/ut76wp.jpg
http://inlandempirestrikesback.net/v-web/gallery/albums/IESBGAMES/Unreal3.jpg
Man oh man is it gonna rock. I have 3 complaints though. 1: Where is the shield gun? 2: Not as jumpy? Not sure how that'll work and still have the feel of the previous games (haven't played UT99 much). 3: Hey! I want Bombing Run! Give it back!
Other than that Envy is gonna be nothing short of amazing. And also that new conquest mode sounds interesting, not sure how much I'll like it though.
 
Post I made in other forums about the same topic:

I hope they don't push Conquest mode too much, because not only will the resulting lack of polish on Deathmatch make it unbalanced and lame, but also because it sounds like they're trying to do two things, both of which are VERY BAD:

1. Imitate Tribes. Even Tribes can't imitate Tribes these days (see: Tribes Vengeance).

2. Make movement more realistic. As Chu once put it, the reason UT2004 is so deep is the movement. There are so many ways to move that even hot-stuff players like LOB's gold team still figure out new ways to move these days.

Imitating Tribes will result in crap if they keep using the current ONS vehicles. They don't have the proper balance that vehicles should have in a first-person shooter.

Making movement more realistic will lose the "deepness," the replay value, of the game and make it worthless for competition or ladder play. Unless, of course, they want to go to a system like Counter-Strike and have your shooting accuracy be equally dependent on your mouse skill and your current state of movement, but that would make Conquest mode suck too, because everybody would be camping on hilltop to hilltop, afraid to run for an objective because they couldn't shoot back accurately.

Point: Change the guns up a little (PLEASE make sure you either stick with the LG or make a balanced sniper rifle), or make the graphics better, introduce one or two new concepts, but keep the emphasis on making a deep game with lots of replay value, just as UT is, and they'll have a game that appeases the fans.

Or, the more likely option: they could make all the fans angry and get new ones based on a completely different gametype, in which case I have no choice but to pray heavily that Quake 4's multiplayer mode is more like Quake 3's multiplayer mode, and less like Doom 3's, or that for some weird reason I enjoy Conquest.

Only time will show.

Another post in a different forum:

It sounds like they have two main objectives for Conquest mode:

1. Make a strategic, objective-based game on humongous, more realistic battlefields.

2. Make combat feel more "in your face" and less long-range.

With the weapons they listed, this seems to be a dichotomy. They can pick one, but not both. The best way that occurs to me to accomplish both those goals is to make combat melee-based, but since UT's entire point is shooting people I don't think that's going to happen, and the only first-person shooter that ever had decent melee in it was Chronicles of Riddick, and that was single player only-- it would be very difficult to implement first-person melee in multiplayer.

Now, they probably won't do that, but I can't think of another option that entirely addresses both goals. Epic has shown in the past that they are more creative than I am, so hopefully they'll find a way, or (my preferred outcome) change their goals.
 
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I'd have to agree. I'd actually be happy if they just left it the way it is (but I like the enforcers better than the assault rifles) and just gave it better graphics. I'd preorder it. I probably still will. Oh, and my vote for FPS with best melee combat goes to Jedi Academy. Lightsabers are fun.
 
Thanks for all those links Killerah. I've been oblivious to the fact that a new UT was planned. Awesome news. CS
 
Much <3 for UnrealEngine3. I've watched every tech demo I can wrap my cable modem around, and they've all been amazing. Sure, I won't be able to play any UE3 games until my wife and I both graduate from college (she graduates in three and a half years) and probably a few years after, but it's still groovy to watch!
 
I hope they don't push Conquest mode too much, because not only will the resulting lack of polish on Deathmatch make it unbalanced and lame
Click to expand...
Well, given Epic's/Digital Extremes' track records, do you really think that's going to happen? UT2004, IMO, was so polished, you could put your makeup on using it. (sry, couldn't think of a better comparison) Really, there was nothing in UT2004 that I could point to and say "wow, that's bad" or "they didn't pay enough attention to this". I really don't see UT becoming a whole different game because they focused too much on one particular gametype. It will only become different if they *meant* it to become different, certainly not from lack of attention to detail.

re: vehicle balancing...huh? I never had a problem with the vehicles - they each serve their purpose, do that purpose well and are weak when used for something other than that purpose. What was unbalanced about them? (Speaking of vehicles, I read on PlanetUnreal that they're planning on 18 (!!!) on 'em)

re: movement changes (some developer quoted about removing the "bounciness" of UT2004 - I can't find the quote anymore)...I totally agree. It's a video game, specifically an *action* video game - the movement shouldn't be realistic. If I wanted realism I'd be playing some WW2 game. UT was/is the last great FPS that *hasn't* gone all "realistic" (aside from Painkiller) and it's changes to player movement (double jump, dodging, wall jumping) are totally unique to the series. To remove that certainly removes the heart and soul of the game and certainly discounts it from being a contender in any professional video gaming leagues. But I don't think it will change that much. After all, they *are* keeping double jumping, so they can't be making it *that* realistic...

re: weapons...I personally would love to see some new weapons. It'll never happen, but just something different than your typical rocket launchers and rail guns. I won't get my wish because you need those prototypical weapons to make great DM matches, but just something new that's useful too would be nice. Painkiller did a great job with it's weapons, especially with the melee weapon, the Painkiller itself. That was a totally unique and original weapon. I loved to see that kind of thinking in the rest of the FPS world.

I'd also love to see more combo weapons, again like Painkiller. Shock comboing is all nice 'n stuff, but I wish that idea were extended to other weapons in the UT universe. Imagine detonating/electrifying a pile of Bio goo with a lighting gun, or charging up a shock ball with the link gun. I dunno, I think it would produce some pretty creative results and some situation specific tactics that would give players lots of options.

(On a side note, is anyone else but me excited about Pariah?)
 
What? Shagz wears makeup? :p (just kidding!)

Seriously, I thought that UT2004 was great in terms of balance too, but the thing is, they don't. I've heard comments (I'll try to find them again) that said that the devs thought 2k4 wasn't very good, which shows either too much modesty or a flawed sense of quality.
 
Yea, I know the quotes you're talking about, saying things like "it really wasn't everything that it should have been". What else did they want to put in there!? :P
 
Cool info! Thanks.

About the game, as developers, I think success is determined by mass appeal rather than a core group of players in the end. They are most likely looking at it from the point of view of "how do we get more players into the game"? The long distance fights they speak of are typical of the more skilled HS players in the community. In other words, how to keep the game fun for skilled players and at the same time introduce new ones without having them get spawn killed by a 1337 HS headshot. IMO, I don't think a broad appeal is necessarily a good idea. UT is fun (to me) because it is competetive. It will be interesting to see the feel of this game. It will probably require upgrades though to enjoy the engine effects.
 
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