Sophia

Master~Plan

Master~Plan

New Member
So, I was in my New Testament class the other day, and in the middle of the lecture, the teacher starts talking about how the Jewish tradition involves an immortal named Sophia representing wisdom?!
She went on to read proverbs 3, and in the passage wisdom is written as if wisdom was a person, but I have never really studied the possibility of wisdom as a being. As I skim through proverbs theres more reference to wisdom as if it was a person.
Does anyone know much on the subject? This doesn't sound like it fits with Jewish teaching at all...
I googled it a little bit, but didn't see anything that looked to lagit. What do you guys think? Is there a Sophia in mainstream Jewish teaching, or was there ever?
 
I have never heard that. I know that Proverbs are Heavenly wisdom with earthly meaning and that it is a book that encourages the study of the Word. Wisdom, understanding, and instruction are all spoken of in the feminine sense. I wonder if that has something to do with the word itself? Interesting, I have never thought about it!
http://www.baptist-city.com/proverbs_lessons.htm These are some audios on the book of Proverbs from one of my favorite preahers, now walking the Streets of Gold!!
 
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^ Yeah, I don't see how an immortal would fit in on the grand hierarchy(sp?) of jewish tradition. Probably along the lines of Cherebim, or angels, I dunno...
My teacher is quite a liberal on the new testament, and likes to stir things up for the sake of arguing I think.
The thought of a immortal representing wisdom is too Greek for me to buy. I couldn't picture a Jew teaching that.
 
Master~Plan said:
^ Yeah, I don't see how an immortal would fit in on the grand hierarchy(sp?) of jewish tradition. Probably along the lines of Cherebim, or angels, I dunno...
My teacher is quite a liberal on the new testament, and likes to stir things up for the sake of arguing I think.
The thought of a immortal representing wisdom is too Greek for me to buy. I couldn't picture a Jew teaching that.
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I must be honest with you, it took me a bit to answer, my first response to hearing about her teaching this was, "Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, the enemy cannot stop the presses on The Word, but he will twist it in every direction until it is unrecognizable!"
You see her day in and day out, it sounds as if you have got her pegged! I am also proud that you have enough wisdom not to be led astray by false teachings.
 
Hm...I'm not entirely sure about this myself, but I would think that the usage of the term "immortal" doesn't necessarily deify anything (like, an immortal soul, or an immortal concept), and "Sopho" is, if I recall correctly, just a Greek term for knowledge or wisdom.
So, from all I can see, personifying a concept/thing (like wisdom) is merely a figurative way of represantation, and not necessarily implying that the concept/thing is a god.
For example, the phrase "O immortal poetry" doesn't mean that poetry is a god.
But I didnt read the passage, so I wouldnt know...
 
I don't see any reason not to believe her. Until someone who has knowledge regarding Jewish history and beliefs chimes in, we're all just guessing anyhow. And really, this isn't a huge issue. Wisdom is personified as being female. It's nothing more than a literary device to connect the reader and associate them better with the concept.
 
Oh, wow. I did some searching and this is an interesting concept that your teacher is bringing up. Sophia/Wisdom is considered by some to be the feminine side of God. In fact, Sophia is what believers of this philosophy consider the Holy Spirit to be. They feel that the feminine aspect of God is ignored in the Bible, but present nonetheless in scripture like the one your teacher shared with you. So basically, Jesus' female name is Sophia in their eyes.

This is deep. Gonna take some more investigation before I can fully understand it.

http://cosmicwind.net/800/Cmwl/Links/SophiaLinks.html
 
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"Oh, wow. I did some searching and this is an interesting concept that your teacher is bringing up. Sophia/Wisdom is considered by some to be the feminine side of God. In fact, Sophia is what believers of this philosophy consider the Holy Spirit to be. They feel that the feminine aspect of God is ignored in the Bible, but present nonetheless in scripture like the one your teacher shared with you. So basically, Jesus' female name is Sophia in their eyes.

This is deep. Gonna take some more investigation before I can fully understand it."

Very very very dangerous ground. This is reading more into our Lord that what is defined in the Bible. Is God not suffient to be taken as He is in the Bible? Do we think He is less than perfect to want to add attributes to Him that are not clearly defined? We have not even begun to scratch the surface of attributes, let alone assign new ones to Him.

I just thought of this too. Should there really be any female sides of God/Jesus if we (the church) are to be His bride?

Gen
 
I hope that you are referring to this belief and not me looking into it further to understand it better. I agree that it is dangerous, which is why I was so completely shocked that this idea even existed.
 
Exactly why is this "dangerous" ground?

I don't know of a single Christian who only accepts the bible at face value, everyone reads something into it, "reading between the lines".
 
It is dangerous because this view is not "reading into" the Bible. It's creating something that simply is not mentioned. In essence, it's no different than the Mormons adding mysterious books to their Bible. You can't just add to it something that you think should have been included or mentioned.
 
I agree that it is dangerous, which is why I was so completely shocked that this idea even existed.
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yeah, this kind of shakes up some stuff if this is mainstream Jewish teaching. All I'm trying to figure out is if this is lagit Jewish teaching, but I haven't been able to pinpoint an answer from what Ive been reading
 
^legit as in non geocities/cite web authors, cite sources, proper dating, reference other matirial.
I"m familiar with the gnostics, and due to the nature of it, I'm sure sophia does play a big part.

I'm not finding much and I don't know enough on the subject as where to look. I guess all questions will be answered on the last day and that is good enogh for me. I think I"m just going to give it the sidestep...
 
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