The Tornado, the Lutherans, and Homosexuality

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Ya know... It is difficult for me to understand how people think sometimes. A lot of Christians will say homosexuality is the worst sin out there and treat homosexuals like lepers. That is wrong... but at the same time it is just as wrong to say "No big deal!" Sin is sin. Would you let someone pastor your church who was living in unrepentant sin? No! Would you allow an alcoholic who was constantly drunk to pastor a church? No! Would you allow a man who is unfaithful to his wife to continue pastoring your church? No!

Practicing homosexuality is a lifestyle of sin that must be shed before one can be a shepherd of a flock. To struggle with it is one thing... but to be practicing it is another all together.

Craziness indeed.
 
Wow that is scary and sad. Very interesting read and from one of my favorite websites too! thanks for the post.
 
john3610 said:
Ya know... It is difficult for me to understand how people think sometimes. A lot of Christians will say homosexuality is the worst sin out there and treat homosexuals like lepers. That is wrong... but at the same time it is just as wrong to say "No big deal!" Sin is sin. Would you let someone pastor your church who was living in unrepentant sin? No! Would you allow an alcoholic who was constantly drunk to pastor a church? No! Would you allow a man who is unfaithful to his wife to continue pastoring your church? No!

Practicing homosexuality is a lifestyle of sin that must be shed before one can be a shepherd of a flock. To struggle with it is one thing... but to be practicing it is another all together.

Craziness indeed.
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well said... just... well said...
 
john3610 said:
Ya know... It is difficult for me to understand how people think sometimes. A lot of Christians will say homosexuality is the worst sin out there and treat homosexuals like lepers. That is wrong... but at the same time it is just as wrong to say "No big deal!" Sin is sin. Would you let someone pastor your church who was living in unrepentant sin? No! Would you allow an alcoholic who was constantly drunk to pastor a church? No! Would you allow a man who is unfaithful to his wife to continue pastoring your church? No!

Practicing homosexuality is a lifestyle of sin that must be shed before one can be a shepherd of a flock. To struggle with it is one thing... but to be practicing it is another all together.

Craziness indeed.
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Reminds me totally of church all right alchoholic, unfaithful pastors (no I'm not being sarcastic). Up here they just move them to a new church so they can start over if any of the above happens.....part of the reason why we didn't go for 18 years. Sunday service with a drunken slur is something I don't wish on anyone.

As for homosexual pastors, there are enough religious leaders in closets they would just have a reason to come out without threat of losing their job/status if it became acceptable. Are there stats that suggest that there would be less homosexuals in those positions if they made it acceptable?
 
The Bible is clear with other rules as well... look at Leviticus 11:9-12.

9These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat.

10And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:

11They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination.

12Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.
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Pastors everywhere sin. Everyone knows that. To single out one sin and ignore others (like these in leviticus) is an injustice to the Bible.

I think that if homosexual pastors cannot serve, then pastors who choose to eat shellfish and do other activities that the bible has said not to do should not be able to serve.
 
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Odale said:
The Bible is clear with other rules as well... look at Leviticus 11:9-12.



Pastors everywhere sin. Everyone knows that. To single out one sin and ignore others (like these in leviticus) is an injustice to the Bible.

I think that if homosexual pastors cannot serve, then pastors who choose to eat shellfish and do other activities that the bible has said not to do should not be able to serve.
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I agree Odale, that any Pastor living in continual, unrepentant sin should not be able to serve. The things you listed, however, are no longer sins (nice try), as God himself ended those specific laws elsewhere in the Bible. The ones that still apply at the end of the canon still apply today.

It is not the specific sin that matters really, its the continual same sin and not being repentant. Someone who struggles with homosexual tendencies, seeks to end them, and is repentant the times they slip up is much different then a gay pastor. A pastor who struggles with homosex is OK while a homosexual pastor is not.
 
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I used a bad example. The bottom line is that pastors sin like everyone else.... continually.
 
Yes you are correct, but does that mean we should condone it? God sets some pretty high standards for those that would be Elders/Leaders of His body. Should we ignore that and make allowances for "lifestyle sins" like homosexuality? It is OK in church leadership since "everyone else is doing it"?
 
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Odale said:
I used a bad example. The bottom line is that pastors sin like everyone else.... continually.
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What you say is true. We are all guilty of sin. God tells us that in multiple places. Romans 3 for example... all have sinned and fallen short of God's glory. Every pastor you will ever come in contact with is guilty of sin. There is a difference though in sinning and in unrepentant sin.

Unrepentant sin is an example of a sinful lifestyle that is willfully taken time after time. For example, if a couple is not married and is continually having sex over and over they are living in a sinful life style and that sin would be considered unrepentant because there is no evidence or intention to change and honor God. The same goes for a homosexual lifestyle. God's word says that that lifestyle is sinful and if a pastor is continually taking part in that same lifestyle and not repenting (which means to ask for forgiveness and turn from the sinful action) they are living in unrepentant sin and are not in a position to shepherd a flock.

It is important to note the difference.. because if sin in itself disbarred us from Christian service then there would not be a single person serving God as clergy. We are human and sinful; although God has forgiven us of all our sins we will still continue to sin till the end of our lives (whether that means lusting, being prideful, being self righteous, etc, etc, etc). But unrepentant sin is a reason to keep someone from being a shepherd of a Christian community because it denotes a willful choice to disobey God time and again without changing.

Hope my explanation was clear. But you are absolutely right... anyone who holds that homosexual sin is more aggregious than the sin you or I partake in is foolish. Sin has seperated each of us from God and anyone that holds that living a homosexual lifestyle is more damning (that is not a curse word in case anyone is wondering) than any other sin is incorrect.
 
*resisting temptation to make an Icthus joke...* You guys set it all up, are you all in cahoots trying to set a trap for me?
 
I need to shut this thread down. The policy of CGA is not to allow discussion of a religious nature to occur in open public forums. Any debate, such as the one above, has to occur in a forum where EVERY post is examined before being made public.

I am not shutting it down due to my own beliefs or Tree's poke at me. I am following the policy set before me by the authority over me.

I should mention CGA has tried religious discussion forums and they have not been successful. This is the reason for the policy.

The discussion is encourage via PM or over TS or Vent in private.

Sorry to be the killjoy.
 
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