Where do morals fit in?

[SLNT_FIR]

@Mr. Bill:

Then could you list some?

@Dark Virtue:

Would someone mind explaining what moral tenet is postulated in the Bible that was not first postulated by another religion/civilization?

What's that supposed to mean? I understand you are saying, the Bible says what all people say, but what does it mean?

 

[Dark Virtue]

Let me try and ask simply.

The Bible contains a set of moral codes set forth, presumably by God. Many Christians feel that these moral codes were listed in the Bible first. I have already proven that the "golden rule" was NOT postulated first in the Bible, but instead by many, older civilizations.

My question was, which of these codes in the Bible were created FIRST by Bible authors and do not appear outside of the Bible previous to its creation?

 

[PapaToad]

Lets Start with Adam and Eve. They lived in paradise, the garden of Eden. They fell into sin we all know the story.

In them was the original blue print of human creation; When then, did this “Moral code exist before them; accept to reside in the Creator, The Great I AM himself??

Infact now that I think on it; It was eating from the tree of knowledge that we gained our wickedness and disobedience from God. Our Moral code was set until we corrupted it.

Gen 3 1-7
The Fall of Man
1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"
2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "
4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."
6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves.



This was when the morals because unbalanced and shifted. From here on we would do our best as mortals to be like God and choose our morals.

DV you may not like our answers, but this is our beliefs, as given to us by the word of God. So I fail to see how you have proven how morals came before God? Yes I concur that our Morals were founded before the advent of Christianity. But I point our God is omnipotent and omnipresent; he knew man would fall, he had with him the “FIX” His Son the Lord Jesus Christ. Ready and waiting on His perfect plan. So I contend again that God Created what is Good and what is moral; The avoidance of his presence is why it Got corrupted.

So my lengthy point is; GOD being the author of the Bible; crated our perfect code/moral/righteous behaviors; our own corruption twisted it and separated us for that source!

 

[Dark Virtue]

DV you may not like our answers, but this is our beliefs, as given to us by the word of God. So I fail to see how you have proven how morals came before God? Yes I concur that our Morals were founded before the advent of Christianity.

I am claiming that morals existed prior to the creation of the Bible, since neither one of us can claim that God exists.

So I ask again, "My question was, which of these codes in the Bible were created FIRST by Bible authors and do not appear outside of the Bible previous to its creation?" What moral codes do Christians claim to have invented that weren't in use by non-Christian societies before the existence of the Bible?

 

[PapaToad]

I am claiming that morals existed prior to the creation of the Bible, since neither one of us can claim that God exists.

So I ask again, "My question was, which of these codes in the Bible were created FIRST by Bible authors and do not appear outside of the Bible previous to its creation?" What moral codes do Christians claim to have invented that weren't in use by non-Christian societies before the existence of the Bible?

The bible as we know it, I can not comment on, But I CLAIM the exsistance of GOd, and Stand and shout the Fact that God had our ""Morals"" hardwired in us to begin with.

So I a disagree that Morals exsisted before GOD, did they exsist before the Bible? That would be a CORRECT and TRue statement as GOD is eternal and Ominipresent. He existed before the advent of Man's written record.

So Morals did exsist before the Bible, but its a moot point, because they came from God. Not as you say other cultures had them because GOD had them imprinted in everyones spirit!

 

[Dark Virtue]

Oh give me a freakin' break.

If what you say is true, then everyone would have the SAME set of morals. But that's not the case though is it?

If man had this "imprint" on their "soul", then why all of the other religions?

 

[Didasko]

No comment yet from anyone on the FACT that supposedly "Christian" morals were postulated long before they appeared in the Bible?

The Bible was not written the day God created the earth. It was written much later. However, God walked with Adam. God interacted with man from the beginning. Just because it was not written down in the Bible before the morals were there is a silly argument.

Of course God's moral code was with man before the Bible was written.

It makes perfect sense that men who strayed away would know and subscribe to many of the morals God set down.

Now to the larger question. Men are not inherently good...we are inherently evil and selfish. But even the most evil of men can exhibit many of the same moral values as the rest of us.

 

[Eon]

That's because who really wants to think of themselves as truly evil - except pathological cases?

Think about it. Most people who commit evil rationalise it as being "For the greater good", don't they?

 

[Dark Virtue]

The Bible was not written the day God created the earth. It was written much later. However, God walked with Adam. God interacted with man from the beginning. Just because it was not written down in the Bible before the morals were there is a silly argument.

Of course God's moral code was with man before the Bible was written.

It makes perfect sense that men who strayed away would know and subscribe to many of the morals God set down.

Now to the larger question. Men are not inherently good...we are inherently evil and selfish. But even the most evil of men can exhibit many of the same moral values as the rest of us.

Say what? Your circular logic amazes me.

You say that the Bible wasn't written until long after the creation of Man, yet you claim that God's moral code was "set down" before the creation of the Bible. Where/how were they set down?

If these moral codes were somehow embedded in the mind/soul of man, why do you claim that man is not inherantly good?

I wouldn't start claiming silly arguments and then proceed to make one

EDIT to ask: Would you mind explaining WHY you believe man is not inherantly good?

 

[Didasko]

You say that the Bible wasn't written until long after the creation of Man, yet you claim that God's moral code was "set down" before the creation of the Bible. Where/how were they set down?

Do you really need that explained more clearly? Well...I guess you wouldn't ask if you didn't. Sometimes DV I think you really know the simple answers to your questions. You just like to ask lots of them

I'll try a simple analogy. When most children learn their ABC's, they learn them through spoken language not written. We learn our ABC's from the verbal teachings of our parents or school teachers. Did the ABC's exist for that preschooler before they saw them written on paper? Of course they did. Do you think God taught Adam anything verbally (since you are a soft athiest you'll need to asume that there is a God for the sake of argument)? Of course He did. Another example of God teaching morals before the written law was Cain and Able.

If these moral codes were somehow embedded in the mind/soul of man, why do you claim that man is not inherantly good?

I never said the moral codes are embedded in the mind or soul

Say what? Your circular logic amazes me.

Works both ways DV! But your circlular arguments don't amaze me

I wouldn't start claiming silly arguments and then proceed to make one.

lol...I'll say this for you DV, you are intertaining

Would you mind explaining WHY you believe man is not inherantly good?

Look at the world...you need more proof?