Ask a Catholic about Catholisism

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Rand NobleBlade

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Hey ya'll Mrpop had said he had some questions for me, anout catholics. so i thought i'd start a new thread so that he and anyone else can respond.

Take care and God Bless
Rand NobleBlade
Paladin
 
Actually, this is kind of reversed, but I'd like to as Protestants about Catholics. lol

How do you, as miracle-believing Chrisitans, deal with the many claimed miracles that the Catholic Church holds so dearly? I refer to things such as the sun dancing, the oil-weeping statues of Mary and Saints, the Mary image on the side of the bank in Florida, and, most incredibly, the apparent literal transubstantiation of the eucharist before an unbelieving preist, which you can still visit today and find pictures of on the net if ya look for it.
 
Alright Rand here are some of my questions. First off why do you guys think you have to confess to a priest? Yeshua is the mediator and we are all the same different clergy members are not higher than us. Also as far as I know you guys to pray to Mary and other saints somtimes when Yeshua said to address all your prayers to the father, why is this practiced?
 
Pop, since I know you're online right now, you can take the first crack at my question. Look above your post.
 
Well I am not a protestent so there is only one point I can really make here. The oil weeping statues and so forth are not biblical. I know that's not a through point but I dont have much background info on them.
 
But if religious relics are sitting in your living room, weeping oil, does it really matter if its happened before? If your cross on the wall (assuming you have one) started dripping blood, wouldnt u see that as a miracle?
 
I hate to say it but I dont know. In my current mind if my cross started dripping blood I would perform an exorcism. But seeing as how it has not happend I cant really give you a answer. All I can do is rely upon the Holy Spirit to tell me. I cant say such a thing would hold a certain significance such as lets say speaking in tongues or healing.
 
i have a question..... how come prests cant get married.. it doesnt say that in the bible.. and if the bible if what catholics belive in.. why do somehting.. thats not in there?
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (pyro4GodR6:13 @ Oct. 05 2003,10:26)]i have a question..... how come prests cant get married.. it doesnt say that in the bible.. and if the bible if what catholics belive in.. why do somehting.. thats not in there?
That is another thing that confuses me about Catholics. Thank God I am Full Gospel.
 
the thing with the weeping statues are not miracles...remember that satan can pass himself off as an angel of light. anyhting can be made to look good or holy..but is it?

regarding catholic dogma, they put man made rules OVER the Bible

this explains

celibacy, confession, purgatory

I was raised Roman Catholic because I disagreed with many of their doctrines. no offense to any Catholic on this board. Like all relgions, salvation depends on the individual not their religious affiliation.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (CCGR @ Oct. 05 2003,11:20)]the thing with the weeping statues are not miracles...remember that satan can pass himself off as an angel of light.  anyhting can be made to look good or holy..but is it?

regarding catholic dogma, they put man made rules OVER the Bible

this explains

celibacy, confession, purgatory  

I was raised Roman Catholic because I disagreed with many of their doctrines.  no offense to any Catholic on this board.  Like all relgions, salvation depends on the individual not their religious affiliation.
Praise God you did not sit idly in your pew. Praise god people still look to their Bibles to clarify what the preacher is preaching is truth.
 
In my Christian days, I was first a Catholic, then a Protestant.

For the clerical celibacy, its the idea of imitation of Christ.

OK Cheryll, but what about the transubstatiation?
 
We are all to imitate Christ therefore if what they say is true no one should get married. That verse was speaking of moral standards and so forth.
 
The Catholic idea is that since the clergy are called to a higher spiritual position, they should imitate him more.....after all, if everyone practiced celibacy, we'd cease to exist
 
oh yeah I believe that communion is a symbol and that the preists don't have the power to call Jesus down from heaven and turn him into a wafer
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (mrpopdrinker @ Oct. 05 2003,7:32)]Alright Rand here are some of my questions. First off why do you guys think you have to confess to a priest? Yeshua is the mediator and we are all the same different clergy members are not higher than us. Also as far as I know you guys to pray to Mary and other saints somtimes when Yeshua said to address all your prayers to the father, why is this practiced?
The Sacrement of Reconciliaton (Confession) stems from the Idea that Church holds of Apolistic decendancy (Thats not the exact phrase, but its close enough. anyway this refers to th Idea that Peter and the other apostles passed on their athourity through the laying on of hands, the same Athority that was given to them by Christ. This athourity has been passed on down the years to the present day clergy. I know i have read in the bible somewhere where Jesus gave the apostle the athority to forgive sins. It is under this basis that the sacriment exists. The Priest is not Forgiving the penetnt's sins throught any athority of his own,he is using the athority that jesus gave the apostles. The "say 10 hail Mary's" part of it is dissapearing, the last couple of times i have gone the priest gave me bible verses to read, and some advise on how to stear clear of the pitfalls i had fallen into. I will try to find the verse where Jesus gives the apostles that athority.

The prayers to mary and the Saints is whats known as the Comunion of the Saints. Its says that we are all the Body of Christ, living and dead, and that those that are in heaven, in the presence of God, can speak freely with Jesus, and that they are also aware of the rest of us still here, since we are all conected through the body of christ. It is more like a prayer line, or prayer request. Like if i had to undergo an operation, i would post on here to ask y'all to pray for me right? well its the same concept, catholics would ask these people who are with God to speak to him on their acount, while they to are praying to Jesus for this problem. Now do some catholocs take it out of control, yes. but every denomination has its extreamists.

Since the Vatican II council the Catholic church has done alot of house cleaning. Alot of the old ways are gone now or fadeing. No mater the minute differences the catholics belive that Jesus is the messiah, that he died and rose agian for the forgivenes of thier sins and that slavation is through him alone. these are the belifes at thier core, as it is for every other christian.

on to the next question. if i didnt answer your question Mrpop let me know and i'll try and restate it. it's 3:30 am here and my eyes are blury, or if y'all need more definition i will try to reserch it more deeply.

Take care and God BLess
Rand NobleBlade
Paladin
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (pyro4GodR6:13 @ Oct. 05 2003,9:26)]i have a question..... how come prests cant get married.. it doesnt say that in the bible.. and if the bible if what catholics belive in.. why do somehting.. thats not in there?
The vow of celebacy's primary function is to free up the prienst that he can foucus souly on his family in the church, His parish. I can kinda see the wisdom in this, casue it take alout of foucus to have a succesfull mairage in this world today, its goto put alot of added stress on to the pastor, to focus on family and flock. I like to refer to this as the Choice of Paul. Paul remained celibit so that he could foucus souly on those who he spread the Gosple to. Would i be oposed to priest that were married, no. I am also in suport of the movment to have female priests. I think some of the most dynamic people in the bible have been women.

But to answer your question pyro The coice of the priest to be celibit, stems from Paul's own choice as recorded in corinthians i think, or was it romans.

Take care cand God Bless.
Rand NobleBlade
 
Yet the Bible never said anything about authority being passed down.  The laying on of hands was for healing, anointing, and instances of prayer over a specific person.

Yes Christ gave the apostles the power to forgive sin.  Yet that was prior to His death and resurection.  While talking to the pastor to get advice on how to avoid certain pitfalls is a good idea, doing it in that little box smacks of being ashamed, and trying to hide from what you have done or are worried about doing.

but because you specifically brought up the Hail Mary's, let's look at this
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou amongst women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.
First this is a prayer, denoted by the ending Amen.  Secondly that first word 'Hail' or 'Ave' means
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]An exclamation of respectful or reverent salutation
 An notice that word reverent.  When we revere something we are worshiping it.  Next we hit the phrase 'Full of Grace' only Christ is full of grace.  We receive grace from Him, there is no other source of grace from our punishments.  We have some scripture references.  And then 'Holy Mary, Mother of God'  Mary was not holy.  She was a normal woman, who had other children after Christ.  The primary definition of holy is
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Regarded with or worthy of worship or veneration; revered:
 This is not something that should be applied in reference to a person, except Christ.  And finally, we get the 'Pray for us sinners, now and at the time of our deaths.' Does this change anything at all?  Assuming the concept of instantly being at Christ's side is correct, do the prayers of others, have any effect on our salvation?  most especially does it have any effect on our salvation at the time of our death?  No.  Salvation must be accepted during life, by the sinner.  It cannot be prayed into being for someone post-mortem.

Anyways, onto the saints prayer.  Did not the angel's tell Paul to not worship him, but rather to worship the Living God?  Why would this be different?  When you ask us to prayer for you, you are not praying to us to do this, rather we are joining in prayer with you.  When you pray to Mary and the saints, you are placing them above other humans, on a level with Christ.  Prayer is an act of worship.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (CCGR @ Oct. 06 2003,12:59)]oh yeah I believe that communion is a symbol and that the preists don't have the power to call Jesus down from heaven and turn him into a wafer
yes, you believe in consubstantiation

catholics, of course, believe in transubstatiation, thinking that the transformation is physical

Catholics believe that this has happened multiple times, the first and greatest around 700 AD, The Miracle of Lanciano. I highly suggest you check this site out: http://www.therealpresence.org/eucharst/mir/lanciano.html

I also find interesting the incorruptible saints. (http://www.therealpresence.org/eucharst/mir/lanciano.html)

I'm sure if I asked this nutcase Leo Volont on this other message board I go to, he could come up with a list of tons of miracles which the Catholic Church claims for their own. In fact, I'm sure Rand is even aware of some. Share with us, Rand. I am truly interested in how the Protestants here deal with these Catholic miracles.
 
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