Can Salvation give a 2nd chance for sinners?

[Zeena]

I have a hard time with the fact that we are all saints.

You agree with God, I see you pointed it out as fact!
Now believe Him my friend!
And walk in this Love that He has shed forth through Christ to YOU
After all, how can we Love unconditionally, unless we first recieve it..err..HIM!

 

[Jeshurun]

A born again believer CANNOT continue to sin..
It's impossible!

As born again believer I mess up and sin everyday. It is not my intention to purposely sin everyday.
I am far from perfect.
Yet when I sin I go and immediatly ask God to forgive me and I repent of it.
Knowing that I have a problem in a certain area that brings forth sin causes me to seek God in prayer and study His word/ to hear it so that I am renewed in my heart/mind which brings about me not sinning in every area of my life.

Zeena if what you say above is true then God's word is not true.

Why is this written in 1 John 1:7-10 "but if we walk in the light , as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanes us from all sin.
If we say we have no sin, we decieve ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
If we confess our sins , he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us."?

And why is this written as well in 1 John 2:1-2 "My little children, I am writing this to you so that you may not sin; but if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and he is the expiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world."?

 

[Zeena]

A born again believer CANNOT continue to sin..
It's impossible!

As born again believer I mess up and sin everyday. It is not my intention to purposely sin everyday.
I am far from perfect.
Yet when I sin I go and immediatly ask God to forgive me and I repent of it.
Knowing that I have a problem in a certain area that brings forth sin causes me to seek God in prayer and study His word/ to hear it so that I am renewed in my heart/mind which brings about me not sinning in every area of my life.

Zeena if what you say above is true then God's word is not true.
Why then is this written in 1 John 2:1-2 " My little children, I am writing this to you so that you may not sin; but if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and he is the expiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world."?

I never said that Christians do not sin..

1 John 3:9
No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.
1 John 5:18
We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the one who was born of God keeps him safe, and the evil one cannot harm him.

I said that Christians do not CONTINUE to sin

You say you sin daily, but then you said it yourself that you do not WANT to continue in sin..
Well, this is because God's seed remains in you
You cannot go on sinning, it is IMPOSSIBLE

I would use this opportunity to exhort you brother..

Romans 13:12
The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.
Matthew 3:11-12
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.
Matthew 3:7-9
Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
Luke 6:48-49
But the one who hears my words and does not put them into practice is like a man who built a house on the ground without a foundation. The moment the torrent struck that house, it collapsed and its destruction was complete."
Galatians 5:26
Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.
Galatians 6:9
And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
Philippians 2:12
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

I will also use this opportunity to build you up brother..

Ephesians 2:13-22
But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.14For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Also..

Ephesians 1:3-5
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory. Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints, Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints, And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church, Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

Romans 11:29
For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

Hebrews 6
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

And this will we do, if God permit.
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak. For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.

And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:That ye be not slothful, but followers of them who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

For when God made promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater, he sware by himself, Saying, Surely blessing I will bless thee, and multiplying I will multiply thee.
And so, after he had patiently endured, he obtained the promise.
For men verily swear by the greater: and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife. Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil;Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Matthew 19:21
Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

Luke 6:40
The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.

John 17:23
I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

1 Corinthains 2:6-13
Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

 

[Jeshurun]

A born again believer cannot continue to sin ... when hes six feet under.
It's impossible!

Lol I just had to throw that in for a laugh.

 

[Dark Virtue]

Wow, based on what I have read, I am tending to lean towards agreement with DV.

See? Logic is good for something after all.

 

[Zeena]

A born again believer cannot continue to sin ... when hes six feet under.
It's impossible!

Lol I just had to throw that in for a laugh.

And we died with Christ! hahaha!

 

[aka Ash]

I said that Christians do not CONTINUE to sin

You say you sin daily, but then you said it yourself that you do not WANT to continue in sin..
Well, this is because God's seed remains in you
You cannot go on sinning, it is IMPOSSIBLE

so you don't sin, ever?....never an impure thought? never? nothing?


I know I do, and when I do I ask for forgiveness. yea...I don't want to, but I do...Paul did. He said

For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

I believe Paul was saying he sins.

I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily

Why die daily if he doesn't sin?

We need to live for Jesus daily, repent for our sins daily, not forget that Jesus is Lord. For if we forget Jesus...who will save us?

 

[Zeena]

so you don't sin, ever?....never an impure thought? never? nothing?


I know I do, and when I do I ask for forgiveness. yea...I don't want to, but I do...Paul did. He said


I believe Paul was saying he sins.



Why die daily if he doesn't sin?

We need to live for Jesus daily, repent for our sins daily, not forget that Jesus is Lord. For if we forget Jesus...who will save us?

Ok, well since no1's actually READING my posts and just making all sortsa assumptions I'm make this so simple even a child can understand it!-lol

Christians still sin!
But they do not continue to sin becuase God has given them a NEW spirit, who does not LIKE sin..Hence they run from it..Sometimes this takes a while, but for us Christians there is no REAL joy while sinning..We Love Jesus, because He Loves us. and becuase we love Him we want to be around Him..When we sin we FEEL (notice the caps) cut off..Though this is not the case, for He continues to love us..

simple enough, I hope?

 

[Zeena]

We Christians need to be reminded once again of God's judgment upon the flesh. "The flesh," says the Lord Jesus, "is of no avail" (John 6.63). Whether it be the sin of the flesh or the righteousness of the flesh, it is futile. That which is born of the flesh, whatever it may be, is flesh, and can never be "unfleshed." Whether it be the flesh in the pulpit, the flesh in the audience, the flesh in prayers, the flesh in consecration, the flesh in reading the Bible, the flesh in singing hymns, or the flesh in doing good-none of these, asserts God, can avail. However much believers may lust in the flesh, God declares it all to be unprofitable; for neither does the flesh profit the spiritual life nor can it fulfill the righteousness of God. Let us now note a few observations concerning the flesh, which the Lord through the Apostle Paul makes in the letter to the Romans.

(1) "To set the mind on the flesh is death" (8.6). According to God's view there is spiritual death in the flesh. The only escape is to commit the flesh to the cross. Regardless how competent it is to do good or to plan and plot so as to draw down the approval of men, God has pronounced upon the flesh simply one judgment: death.

(2) "The mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God" (8.7). The flesh is opposed to God. Not the slightest chance is there of peaceful co-existence. This holds true in regard not only to the sins which issue from the flesh but also to its noblest thoughts and actions. Obviously defiling sins are

hostile to God, but let us observe that righteous acts can be done independently of God as well.

(3) "It does not submit to God's law, indeed it cannot" (8.7). The better the flesh works the farther away it is from God. How many of the "good" people are willing to believe in the Lord Jesus? Their self-righteousness is not righteousness at all; it is actually unrighteousness. None can ever obey all the teaching of the Holy Bible. Whether a person is good or bad, one thing is certain: he does not submit to God's law. In being bad he transgresses the law; in being good be establishes another righteousness outside of Christ and thus misses the purpose of the law ("through the law comes knowledge of sin" 3.20).

(4) "Those who are in the flesh cannot please God" (8.8). This is the final verdict. Regardless how good a man may be, if the doing is out from himself it cannot please God. God is pleased with His Son alone; aside from Him and His work no man nor work can delight God. What is performed by the flesh may seem to be quite good; nevertheless, because it derives from self and is done in natural strength it cannot satisfy God. Man may devise many ways to do good, to improve, and to advance, but these are carnal and cannot please Him. This is not only true of the unregenerate; it is likewise true of the regenerated person. However commendable and effective should anything be that is done in his own strength the believer fails to draw down upon himself the approval of God. God's pleasure or displeasure is not founded upon the principle of good and evil. Rather, God traces the source of all things. An action may be quite correct, yet God inquires, what is its origin?

From these Scripture references we can begin to appreciate how vain and futile are the efforts of the flesh. A believer who is shown precisely God's estimation of it will not blunder easily. As human beings we distinguish between good works and evil works; God on the other hand goes behind and makes a distinction as to the source of every work. The most excellent deed of the flesh brings down upon it the same displeasure of God, as would the most defiled and wicked work, for they all are of the flesh. Just as God hates unrighteousness, so He abhors self -righteousness. The good acts done naturally without the necessity of regeneration or union with Christ or dependence upon the Holy Spirit are no less carnal before God than are immorality, impurity, licentiousness, etc. However beautiful man's activities may be, if they do not spring from a complete trust in the Holy Spirit they are carnal and are therefore rejected by God. God opposes rejects and hates everything belonging to the flesh regardless of outward appearances and regardless whether done by a sinner or a saint. His verdict is: the flesh must die.

 

[Dark Virtue]

Ok, well since no1's actually READING my posts and just making all sortsa assumptions I'm make this so simple even a child can understand it!-lol

Christians still sin!
But they do not continue to sin...

simple enough, I hope?

What everyone else is trying to tell you is that Christians still sin, PERIOD. No matter what you want to say after it, CHRISTIANS STILL SIN.

This is exactly opposite to what you said earlier, which is why clarification was needed.

 

[Zeena]

What everyone else is trying to tell you is that Christians still sin, PERIOD. No matter what you want to say after it, CHRISTIANS STILL SIN.

This is exactly opposite to what you said earlier, which is why clarification was needed.

And did I say otherwise?

I'll tell you this much as well, I may sin, but I also may NEVER sin again!
I have sin IN me (that is, in my flesh), but it does not mean I have to yeild to temptation.

By the Power of the indwelling Holy Spirit Jesus conquers this withing man..That is, his slavery to sin and ever increasing wickedness..

Make noooo mistake, the "flesh" IS in ascendancy as long as you continue to walk after it..But if you walk after the Spirit you will not fullfill the lusts of the flesh

 

[Dark Virtue]

And did I say otherwise?

I'll tell you this much as well, I may sin, but I also may NEVER sin again!
I have sin IN me (that is, in my flesh), but it does not mean I have to yeild to temptation.

By the Power of the indwelling Holy Spirit Jesus conquers this withing man..That is, his slavery to sin and ever increasing wickedness..

Make noooo mistake, the "flesh" IS in ascendancy as long as you continue to walk after it..But if you walk after the Spirit you will not fullfill the lusts of the flesh

As long as you are corporeal, human and a Christian, you WILL sin.

 

[aka Ash]

And did I say otherwise?

I'll tell you this much as well, I may sin, but I also may NEVER sin again!
I have sin IN me (that is, in my flesh), but it does not mean I have to yeild to temptation.

By the Power of the indwelling Holy Spirit Jesus conquers this withing man..That is, his slavery to sin and ever increasing wickedness..

Make noooo mistake, the "flesh" IS in ascendancy as long as you continue to walk after it..But if you walk after the Spirit you will not fullfill the lusts of the flesh

I finally understand what you are saying....and agree

Praise God

and thank you Zeena for clarifying...

We are no longer slaves to sin, and do not have to continue to sin. Through the guidance of the Holy Spirit we further perfect ourselves, and sin becomes less and less.
w00t! God is great!

 

[Zeena]

Originally Posted by 1 Corinthians 15:31
I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily

Just three verses down is this..

34Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

 

[aka Ash]

Originally Posted by aka Ash
Originally Posted by 1 Corinthians 15:31
I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily

Just three verses down is this..

34Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

this is telling us not to sin, it doesn't say we won't sin.

 

[Zeena]

this is telling us not to sin, it doesn't say we won't sin.

I often hear Christians asking forgiveness of thier sins

Hebrews 10:17
Then he adds: "Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more."

WHY then would you shove them in His face as if He did not atone for them?

If we Live by Faith in JESUS, that is HIM Living His Holy, Righteous, Blameless Life in us we do NOT sin! Jesus fullfills the Law of God in and through us!

Who lives in YOU?
Who's Life did you recieve when you repented of your sins and were washed?
Was it not the Life of Jesus..Be careful how you answer..For the measure of the glory of the Lord to be revealed in you hinges on this very confession..

And is He Holy?
Is He Righteous?
Does He ALWAYS do what pleases the Father?

It's Jesus that is the overcomer! NOT US!!!

And if we are Christians then we now have NEW desires to be like Him!
BUT---He will give His Glory to nooo other!

It's it's Jesus or the highway!
Thinking we can overcome apart from the Life of Jesus is more than ridiculus for us who believe! For we KNOW, because we have come from a defeated life already, that no flesh can inherite the Kingdom of God! WHY, as though you were under the Law do you submit to it's rules? Do not handle, do not touch! Such rules have the appearance of wisdom but they LEAD to death! Jesus is the Life that God sent from Heaven! And God did not just send Him to us to be a witness, but OUR Life, our Righteousness, our very breath!

Apart from Him you can do nothing..
Keep your eyes on Jesus, and you can walk on water

I can, in the Spirit of my God and yours provide scripture referances for EVERY word I have spoken this day..If you like, I would be honoured..

 

[Hmmmm]

Eh. I get what he's trying to say, but its hard to explain..

 

[Durruck]

this is telling us not to sin, it doesn't say we won't sin.

I often hear Christians asking forgiveness of thier sins

This is most abhorent to God and aught not to be so!
Did Jesus die for those sins? Are those sins EVER in rememberance before God? Are those same sins you ask forgiveness for the same ones that were cast into the sea of forgetfullness?

Then he adds: "Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more."

WHY then would you shove them in His face as if He did not atone for them?

If we Live by Faith in JESUS, that is HIM Living His Holy, Righteous, Blameless Life in us we do NOT sin! Jesus fullfills the Law of God in and through us!

But at the same time... by asking Jesus for forgiveness, are we not stepping up and telling Him that we understand our positions - that we do not deserve what He has given us, and thanking Him for taking our place?

Doesn't admitting our wrongs to God show that we are honest with Him and ourselves?

Doesn't it show that we're not afraid to admit that we're not perfect, and by asking Him to forgive and help us, give Him an open door to help mould us?

Doesn't it give Him another way to help make us who we want to (and should) be?


As with the relationship that I have with those around me. I'm willing to admit when I'm wrong, to ask forgiveness for my transgretions. This is an act of LOVE. I show that I'm willing to put it all out there.

Luke 17:3-4 If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him. If he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times comes back to you and says, `I repent,' forgive him.

Note that the Bible tells us the critical part of the forgiveness is the repentance. In Lk17:3, if the brother sins, rebuke. If the brother repents, forgive.

If we do not ask God to forgive us, we are not showing that we regret our mistakes... we are not repenting our sins.

I agree with Ash. We're supposed to ask forgiveness for our sins. If I sin against my brother, I need to ask him for forgiveness. If I sin against God by not following his word, I need to ask Him for forgiveness as well. I'm not rubbing salt into Jesus' palm, I'm showing him that I understand what He did for me, and thanking him.

 

[Goose62]

To sum up the original question with an answer:
Yes, salvation is God's way of giving sinners a second chance. All you have to to is ask.

 

[aka Ash]

I often hear Christians asking forgiveness of thier sins

This is most abhorent to God and aught not to be so!

Yes, actually I would love to see scripture that backs up that statement.
sin is abhorant to God. So it's a sin to ask forgiveness for your transgressions against God?