Article: Thou Shalt Not Kill, Except in a Popular Video Game at Church

Tek7

Tek7

CGA President, Tribe of Judah Founder & President
Staff member
I think it's awesome. What did Paul do to preach to the Jews? He immersed himself in the Jewish culture and lifestyle. How else are you going to reach to teenagers if you don't do the same?
 
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tjguitarz said:
I think it's awesome. What did Peter do to preach to the Jews? He immersed himself in the Jewish culture and lifestyle. How else are you going to reach to teenagers if you don't do the same?
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It's a thin line between reaching the lost by making the Gospel culturally relevant and watering down the Gospel to appeal to popular culture.

I believe the church staff quoted in this article are missing a key point: Many, if not most, of the youth participating in these events are under 17. Halo is a M-rated games and can not be purchased by anyone under 17. Unless the churches are requiring youth's parents to sign a release form before allowing youth to play the games, one could draw parallels between this practice to draw in youth and showing R-rated movies at youth group. If Halo 3 was rated T (for Teen), it would be a very different scenario--just as showing a PG-13 movie at a youth group would be more raise fewer issues than showing a R-rated movie in the same setting.

It may seem hypocritical of the President of a Christian gaming group to criticize churches for allowing youth under 17 to play M-rated games, but I have never suggested that anyone 16 or under should play M-rated games without their parents' consent.

Does every parent with a child 16 or younger know that their child is playing a M-rated game at church?

How would those parents react if a youth leader bought that child a ticket to a R-rated movie?

I'm not advocating censorship and I'm certainly not advocating a "Big Brother" state. But ratings exist for a reason. Churches should respect a parent's authority as superior to that of the youth pastor or senior pastor in regards to their own child.

My old youth pastor once said that he could only find one example of a youth pastor in the Bible: Parents.

There's a level of trust that people place in the church. I have to believe that some parents don't suspect that their child under 17 is playing a M-rated game at youth group. While one could argue that the parent should be more involved in the child's life, one could also argue that churches should only allow teens under 17 whose parents have been informed and signed a release form to play M-rated games.

If a 16-year old walked into any law-abiding LAN center in the US, they would be required to have their parents sign a release form before playing a M-rated game. What does it say when churches do not meet the same standard as secular businesses?

Yes, the church should try to reach people where they are. They should use culture as a tool to preach the Gospel. But they shouldn't be so daft as to ignore the law--and common sense--to do so. The Gospel is not such a weak thing that we have to stoop to skirting the law or common sense to preach it.

And even if youth groups are requiring parents of children under 17 to sign release forms before those children can play M-rated games, that doesn't take into account those youth under 17 who watch the game as others play it.

If a church wants to hold a Halo 3 tournament, that's their prerogative--but if they want to abide by the law, they need to check IDs at the door, confirm that everyone participating is at least 17 years of age, and turn away anyone under 17. If they follow those simple rules, then the discussion shifts from legal to moral.

And that is another discussion altogether.
 
tjguitarz said:
I think it's awesome. What did Peter do to preach to the Jews? He immersed himself in the Jewish culture and lifestyle. How else are you going to reach to teenagers if you don't do the same?
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Paul tried to use greek philosophy and failed horribly until he gave in and just preached the gospel without trying to explain it in cultural aspects.

A large portion of this generation goes to church on sunday for their "Jesus pill" then walks away and lives however they want. Often times people get so caught up in delivering the message in a pretty format that they fail terribly at getting the message to people and having them receive it and understand it.

Using a games to help spread the gospel is brilliant, after all they are using it as a form of fellowship and dissect the values in the game. Of course to every approach you will have a slippery path to fall down.
 
well you moved the argument into not disobeying your parents. Those ratings are used so people who have not seen the movie/game have an idea before they view it what it contains.

If the argument is exposing kids to a form of entertainment which their parents would disapprove of, then its a no-brainer.

Many parents, myself included, dont mind my son killing bad guys and monsters, and if the church is using it to reach the community like mine is, then its a great idea. There are many kids who would be caught dead at church, but would be willing to show up for a lan party.

Lots of different issues in this one. Thou shall not murder, does not apply to killing bad guys and monsters.

Obeying your parents. well if your parents dont want their kids to be doing it, where they do it is not really the issue.

Using it as an outreach, again, killing bad guys and monsters at home or at church.. Well if its at church at least they are more than likely to be open to coming to a youth group. Most people in this age category being discussed here have never been to, nor would not be caught dead at church, using games like this as an outreach is a great idea as far as I am concerned.

"I think it's awesome. What did Peter do to preach to the Jews? He immersed himself in the Jewish culture and lifestyle. How else are you going to reach to teenagers if you don't do the same?"

yea man, talk about an easy outreach, its the easiest thing ever. Do we get kids who are not christian? you betya. Do they get a good experience at 'church' hanging out with a lot of believers, you betya. Do they keep coming back? yup
 
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you can also just say that the ESRB does a horrible job (which they do) and is not rated proportionally. My youthgroup ran into the same problems and got into mad trouble for it too, because a student's parent did not want them ever to play halo 2, so he lied and went to Never Never LAN and played it all night, much to the dismay of the parents. so it is an issue and having signed sheets by parents is just fine.
 
Tek7 said:
It's a thin line between reaching the lost by making the Gospel culturally relevant and watering down the Gospel to appeal to popular culture.
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The way to tell the difference is to ask whether what is being watered down is the self-righteous, judgmental attitudes of many traditional churches, or the messsage of the Gospel itself. In most cases I think it is the former rather than the latter.
 
There is nothing in law that says that M rated games cannot be bought or played by people under 17. The rating system the ESRB provides is completely OPTIONAL, and the retailers that enforce the restrictions are doing so voluntarily. There are still places that do not enforce such age restrictions.

It is definitely a moral issue to consider, but it is certainly not a legal one.
 
When I say it treads the thin line of legality, I mean a parent could sue the church for a minor offense like that. Sure it's not illegal, but it raises up issues of conscience that need to be settled with the church elders, and probably the youths' parents.

For some, like myself and my parents, it is not a sin to play M rated video games (head shots = happiness). For others, it's a sin to even play video games. It's important not to turn people off from the Good News because of a decision on a game.
 
depends, ive been carded sometimes and sometimes not by EBgames, wal-mart, and a local place. and no i did not get the same checkers
 
Well my area is pretty unusually conservative. Wonderful things you can be fined unless you follow: You can only have sex in the missionary position, you can't have sex outside of marriage, cussing in front of a cop, cant buy alcohol until 2PM on sunday, farting in a public building. Yeah, sometimes I wonder why they pass them and continue to uphold em...
 
In Michigan it is illegal to cuss in front of a lady. I completely agree with that, and I'm ready to press charges if anyone swears in front of my girlfriend. :-)
 
ChickenSoup said:
Where the heck did you get that?
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What the girlfriend or the law :P

ok, that was pretty mean...

If you live in a conservative area usually you have all kinds of interesting laws [to use] against public rudeness and indignity. Of course private property is another matter, generally you can do whatever you want as long as it is not visible. Several founding fathers actually considered private property evil because it is impossible to govern it.
 
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