Concerning Hell

[b said:
Quote[/b] (MontrezAnthony @ Aug. 20 2004,11:46)]I did and I have given it less and less thought of late. Especially now. I do not know what hell is like, I can only reference what was here about is:

Luke 16
22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell,[3] where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
25"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'
27"He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

There are many biblical references. But I think the key point here is torment. Whatever that torment is. Does put sadness and dread in my heart for any who suffer it.
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That is a PARABLE. Parables are not true, they are stories Jesus made up to get His point across.
 
That is a PARABLE. Parables are not true, they are stories Jesus made up to get His point across.

Jesuses Point across???

Jango, I am sorry I could not spell it out more clearly

Jesus was IMPLYING HELL is torment. now I can not fathom what torment it is going to be like. But coming from the son of God, a mon would could heal the sick, raise the dead and cast our demons. I can only deduce Torment can not be pleasant

tor·ment ( P ) Pronunciation Key (tôrmnt)
n.
Great physical pain or mental anguish.
A source of harassment, annoyance, or pain.
The torture inflicted on prisoners under interrogation.

So do you think that can be what the Lord Christ was trying to get across to everyone.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
Jesus was IMPLYING HELL is torment.
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Noo. Jesus was implying that those who live richly and do not help the poor shall be punished.

No one alive now knows exactly what "hell" is. Some thinks it's actually the literal definition. A lake of fire, where people live forever in torment.
Some believe it's a lake of fire, but people die instantly and only the false prophet and satan are tormented forever.
Some believe it's eternal seperation from God.
( Which would be torment, if Jesus does come to Earth and everyone realizes He is God and worships Him. )
 
Again, "torment" could be eternal seperation from God.
Think outside of the box, life isn't black and white.
 
OH my Jango you are right, But seperation from God would be Hell. You might not think thats bad, but I have coffee with him daily, I would miss Father GOd
 
You know what the Mormon's believe about hell? This bit of information still remains the foremost thing that turns me away from their faith. Apparently, when you die in the Mormon faith, there isn't just a heaven and a hell. There's different 'levels of eternity.' For instance, there's the Celestial Kingdom, Telestial Kingdom, and Terrestrial Kingdom. There's also a 'no-zone' kind of existance, equivilant to hell I suppose. What I don't understand is how one determines which level one gets into when the time comes. If you're almost good enough for Celestial, but not quite, is it fair and right for you to be in the same kindgom as someone that barely made the cut? It's as though they quantified faith, which thoroughly confuses and angers me. I don't think all Mormons believe this though, so don't take my word for it.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (MontrezAnthony @ Aug. 27 2004,2:51)]outside the Box is balck and white, there is no grey with God.
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Do you know exactly what God wants?

No. There is grey everywhere, nothing is black and white.
 
Yes I do

The Parable of the Good Samaritan AKA the Greatest Commandment

25On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. "Teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
26"What is written in the Law?" he replied. "How do you read it?"
27He answered: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind'[1] ; and, 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'[2] "
28"You have answered correctly," Jesus replied. "Do this and you will live."


The Great Commission

16Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. 17When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted. 18Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in[1] the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

So there you have it, Love and spread the Good News, and as far as grey what is grey. I really don’t understand your thinking.

It is my opinion grey areas are for those trying to justify wrong decisions. I told you what I thought of hell, and you tell me its not black and white, Sure it is, our understanding my be lacking. And as far as What God wants us to do I answered that as well. If you think there is something different, You are not hearing with your heart. All missions from god fall under those advancing His kingdom thru salvation of His Son Jesus Christ. If you do not believe me, that is not my fault. And there is no flaw in my reasoning, because you do not understand how I came to that conclusion.

So I am not arguing hat point of greys, I do not see them as you do
 
Well you're a fideist, and I'm an evidentialist, so I suppose it's natural that we have a different view on gray area. What I fail to understand is how you feel that there is no gray area in your faith. Becuase basically by definition, faith is one big gray area, hence the necessity to rely on faith rather than fact.
 
I said no grey area with God, with amn just look at the forum. We do not so much a grey area as a difference of opionins
 
Of course there's no gray area with god, but we are not god. We can only interperet god, hence all the different belief systems.
 
Explain to us then, why God didn't just make it clearer.

Why all the confusion?

God knew how stupid we are, he could have make it exceedingly clear.

Yet the Bible, His only work that holds his commandments, is horribly open to interpretation.

What happened to "God is not the author of confusion?"
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Dark Virtue @ Aug. 28 2004,7:14)]Explain to us then, why God didn't just make it clearer.

Why all the confusion?

God knew how stupid we are, he could have make it exceedingly clear.

Yet the Bible, His only work that holds his commandments, is horribly open to interpretation.

What happened to "God is not the author of confusion?"
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Are you talking about English or Aramic/Greek writtings? If your talking English, wouldn't it be plausable that satan would use man to try and screw up the teachings of God? I mean, go back to Constantine and his incorporation of paganism into Christianity. That alone is enough to completly through off the church in its mission on earth. Now you add in fifteen + different "english" translations, of course they are confusing. Satan sows the seed of discord in the world, and yet God takes the blame for it.

As for right/wrong or black/white, when it comes to God, there is no grey. There is God, and then there is sin. There is no in between. Christ is the bridge for us to overcome the sin and be reconciled with God. Without Christ, we just have the law. Without a temple, we cannot offer atonement for our sins so the law is not enough.

Cory
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Are you talking about English or Aramic/Greek writtings? If your talking English, wouldn't it be plausable that satan would use man to try and screw up the teachings of God? I mean, go back to Constantine and his incorporation of paganism into Christianity. That alone is enough to completly through off the church in its mission on earth. Now you add in fifteen + different "english" translations, of course they are confusing. Satan sows the seed of discord in the world, and yet God takes the blame for it.
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If what you're saying is true, how is anyone who doesn't understand Greek/Aramaic supposed to know what is the true word of God? According to your logic every single translation done holds the possibility of being tainted by Satan.
 
[b said:
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What happened to "God is not the author of confusion?"
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According to a pastor I know that has read the old Greek versions and manuscripts of the Bible, that verse isn't in it.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Thaddius @ Aug. 28 2004,8:31)]As for right/wrong or black/white, when it comes to God, there is no grey.  There is God, and then there is sin.  There is no in between.  Christ is the bridge for us to overcome the sin and be reconciled with God.  Without Christ, we just have the law.  Without a temple, we cannot offer atonement for our sins so the law is not enough.
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But god's word does not come directly. It's been interpereted, hence the thousands of different sects.
 
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